My philosophy is to do whatever you can do, but once you have, stop worrying since you literally did all you can do. You may not like the situation you find yourself in, but at that point you can at least stop beating yourself up about it.
I just started my second yearly reading of “The Daily Stoic” by Ryan Holiday. And it has been a pleasure to learn more about how the Stoics saw life. I don’t always agree with their views, mind you.
I loved what you said here: // “We should be more like ourselves and not less.” //
Thanks. Yeah, Stoicism is so hot right now, and that always makes me question something. That’s just the way I am. But we can take parts of philosophies and make our own. I like that idea. In general I am not about restraining myself. I lived too much that way, I am instead more into turning loose the self.
I’m very similar. I buck against restraints and limitations. And I much prefer to “take what I love & leave the rest” for most things…. thereby creating my own systems that work for me.
"I am a romantic, and I cannot escape emotional intensity any easier than pretending some part of my body is not there. Furthermore, would it be accurate to surmise that the world lacks enough people who take themselves too seriously? Could burying emotions be a solution for what ails us now? No and no, methinks.
"As an artist, parts of Stoicism do not ring true and could never be my guiding light out the world’s darkness. I believe we need more authenticity, spontaneity, empathy, and tenderness. We should be more like ourselves and not less."
For me, Stoicism is not about escaping emotional intensity or pretending big emotions aren't present. It's not about burying emotions or scaling back our authenticity, spontaneity, empathy, or tenderness. Instead, Stoicism is about allowing ourselves to feel the full range of our emotions while 1) Acknowledging that feelings are just that and shouldn't run our lives; and 2) Acknowledging the damage caused by violently holding onto negative feelings about that which we cannot change. Being stuck in rumination causes anxiety, despair, and eventually leads to apathy, which is a form of creative death. For me, Stoicism allows me to be creative because it protects me from ruminating over uncontrollables.
Hey, thanks for reading and for your interest in the story. I think whatever works for someone is great--with obvious limitations of being harmful. Lots of people like Stoicism now so I believe it has good parts. I am more talking about Stoicism as it existed in the ancient world, and I know many authors now have their own takes on what it can be. I will never disagree with what gets someone from point A of whatever issues to point B of better mental health.
Stoicism is a valuable philosophy, but I find it difficult to apply in practice—at least for myself. While it has gained popularity, this trend has diluted its true essence and purpose. I believe you should follow a philosophy or way of life only if you truly believe in it, not just because it’s popular or others are doing the same.
I agree, really I do. I can see the good in different values and approaches to life. Stoicism has been influential, but I’m not sure why it is so popular right now. I’m sure someone probably knows. Most people are bandwagon jumpers. As you say, each person should decide for themselves. Actually, I think every person should invent their own philosophy and call it by their name, with ism on the end. Even if the philosophy is almost exactly like something else, doing this offers ownership and pride in my opinion. Thanks so much for saying this.
I don't seek to follow stoicism, but some of my personal philosophy has proven to be stoic in nature. Religiously speaking, people get into stressful prayer cycles trying to convince God to do things their way. I find myself in that cycle and developed a concept I called Worst-case Faith. You tell God what you're hoping for but also that you trust Him for any outcome. -- I want intentionally copying stoicism but that's basically what it is. It's a great stess reducer
That’s a good point. I like the idea of letting go of certain worries. Whatever works is fine. Academics tend to be more serious about separating philosophies than “civilians.” Philosophies bleed into each other. I have seen life from the academic side of things and then, well, what people consider the lowly side. Anyway, I like this perspective I’ve been given to combine more than divide.
Have you read John Sellars or, Kai Whiting. I ask only because your experience of Stoicism isn't reflective of mine. I have found that in terms of emotions that the philosophy, encourages regulation rather than suppression. But I do understand where that train of thought comes from.
Hello. Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge. Those authors have been added to my list. I don’t mind at all when someone disagrees. Though, I find my statements on Stoicism to be generally true in its ancient form. I think modern authors have broadened Stoicism, which is fine.
A certain amount of reconstruction is necessary, but I found that spending an inordinate amount of time on the original sources with help from academics helped me appreciate them. I am not a big fan of moderns like Irvine and Holiday for example. I am currently dying, how quickly depends on chemo, but if not for Stoicism, I don't think Id be handling it as well. Do I experience, extreme emotions, not anymore. I experience sadness, I often cry, and yet I think the ancients would have been fine with this. I experience joy too. My wife and I have become closer. I’ll make no further claims. I am in a unique position, and this could be my take on Stoicism. But I bristle at the preponderance of Broocosm and Meme stoicism as much as I suspect you do. In the end I just hope to be virtuous, the best I can for my fellow humans, animals and the planet. It was good to read your take.
You have a perspective that I cannot have and that probably makes you wiser than us all. Of course, I am glad you found what philosophy works for you. That’s all that matters. Virtue is never out of fashion. That’s where ancients and moderns agree—at least the more enlightened ones. I am glad to meet you. Don’t be a stranger around here. I say what I believe here but always with respect. Or, I think so anyway.
I read Meditations a while back--in youthful days when I didn't have a philosophy and didn't know I needed one. You've given me a Cliff Notes review, so thanks for that. These days, I'm in search of the place I belong on that Optimization-Stoicism spectrum.
My philosophy is to do whatever you can do, but once you have, stop worrying since you literally did all you can do. You may not like the situation you find yourself in, but at that point you can at least stop beating yourself up about it.
Thanks Nick. I’ve gotten much better and not beating myself up.
Very interesting perspective!
I just started my second yearly reading of “The Daily Stoic” by Ryan Holiday. And it has been a pleasure to learn more about how the Stoics saw life. I don’t always agree with their views, mind you.
I loved what you said here: // “We should be more like ourselves and not less.” //
And I thoroughly agree with that!
Thanks. Yeah, Stoicism is so hot right now, and that always makes me question something. That’s just the way I am. But we can take parts of philosophies and make our own. I like that idea. In general I am not about restraining myself. I lived too much that way, I am instead more into turning loose the self.
I’m very similar. I buck against restraints and limitations. And I much prefer to “take what I love & leave the rest” for most things…. thereby creating my own systems that work for me.
Also, regarding Optimization (or being against it), you might enjoy Zoe’s writing:
https://open.substack.com/pub/zoescaman
I for sure will check out this author. Thanks very much.
My pleasure!
"I am a romantic, and I cannot escape emotional intensity any easier than pretending some part of my body is not there. Furthermore, would it be accurate to surmise that the world lacks enough people who take themselves too seriously? Could burying emotions be a solution for what ails us now? No and no, methinks.
"As an artist, parts of Stoicism do not ring true and could never be my guiding light out the world’s darkness. I believe we need more authenticity, spontaneity, empathy, and tenderness. We should be more like ourselves and not less."
For me, Stoicism is not about escaping emotional intensity or pretending big emotions aren't present. It's not about burying emotions or scaling back our authenticity, spontaneity, empathy, or tenderness. Instead, Stoicism is about allowing ourselves to feel the full range of our emotions while 1) Acknowledging that feelings are just that and shouldn't run our lives; and 2) Acknowledging the damage caused by violently holding onto negative feelings about that which we cannot change. Being stuck in rumination causes anxiety, despair, and eventually leads to apathy, which is a form of creative death. For me, Stoicism allows me to be creative because it protects me from ruminating over uncontrollables.
Hey, thanks for reading and for your interest in the story. I think whatever works for someone is great--with obvious limitations of being harmful. Lots of people like Stoicism now so I believe it has good parts. I am more talking about Stoicism as it existed in the ancient world, and I know many authors now have their own takes on what it can be. I will never disagree with what gets someone from point A of whatever issues to point B of better mental health.
Good stuff my friend!
Thank you my friend.
Stoicism is a valuable philosophy, but I find it difficult to apply in practice—at least for myself. While it has gained popularity, this trend has diluted its true essence and purpose. I believe you should follow a philosophy or way of life only if you truly believe in it, not just because it’s popular or others are doing the same.
I agree, really I do. I can see the good in different values and approaches to life. Stoicism has been influential, but I’m not sure why it is so popular right now. I’m sure someone probably knows. Most people are bandwagon jumpers. As you say, each person should decide for themselves. Actually, I think every person should invent their own philosophy and call it by their name, with ism on the end. Even if the philosophy is almost exactly like something else, doing this offers ownership and pride in my opinion. Thanks so much for saying this.
I don't seek to follow stoicism, but some of my personal philosophy has proven to be stoic in nature. Religiously speaking, people get into stressful prayer cycles trying to convince God to do things their way. I find myself in that cycle and developed a concept I called Worst-case Faith. You tell God what you're hoping for but also that you trust Him for any outcome. -- I want intentionally copying stoicism but that's basically what it is. It's a great stess reducer
That’s a good point. I like the idea of letting go of certain worries. Whatever works is fine. Academics tend to be more serious about separating philosophies than “civilians.” Philosophies bleed into each other. I have seen life from the academic side of things and then, well, what people consider the lowly side. Anyway, I like this perspective I’ve been given to combine more than divide.
Have you read John Sellars or, Kai Whiting. I ask only because your experience of Stoicism isn't reflective of mine. I have found that in terms of emotions that the philosophy, encourages regulation rather than suppression. But I do understand where that train of thought comes from.
Hello. Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge. Those authors have been added to my list. I don’t mind at all when someone disagrees. Though, I find my statements on Stoicism to be generally true in its ancient form. I think modern authors have broadened Stoicism, which is fine.
A certain amount of reconstruction is necessary, but I found that spending an inordinate amount of time on the original sources with help from academics helped me appreciate them. I am not a big fan of moderns like Irvine and Holiday for example. I am currently dying, how quickly depends on chemo, but if not for Stoicism, I don't think Id be handling it as well. Do I experience, extreme emotions, not anymore. I experience sadness, I often cry, and yet I think the ancients would have been fine with this. I experience joy too. My wife and I have become closer. I’ll make no further claims. I am in a unique position, and this could be my take on Stoicism. But I bristle at the preponderance of Broocosm and Meme stoicism as much as I suspect you do. In the end I just hope to be virtuous, the best I can for my fellow humans, animals and the planet. It was good to read your take.
You have a perspective that I cannot have and that probably makes you wiser than us all. Of course, I am glad you found what philosophy works for you. That’s all that matters. Virtue is never out of fashion. That’s where ancients and moderns agree—at least the more enlightened ones. I am glad to meet you. Don’t be a stranger around here. I say what I believe here but always with respect. Or, I think so anyway.
I read Meditations a while back--in youthful days when I didn't have a philosophy and didn't know I needed one. You've given me a Cliff Notes review, so thanks for that. These days, I'm in search of the place I belong on that Optimization-Stoicism spectrum.
You’re welcome. I think that is a good place to be.
No need for extremes. No need to follow someone else. I think if you have a purpose you have a philosophy.